Ep. 357: Grow and Scale Your Side Hustle (without Burnout) with Angela Henderson

Speaker 2: Welcome to episode 357 of pep talks for side hustlers. And I am so excited to introduce you to today's guest Angela Henderson, who is an international award-winning business coach for women. She's a keynote speaker and a podcaster who helps women in business get all the pieces in place to have consistent five figure months, and then go on to six and seven figure years without burning out in the process. And her podcast is the business and life conversations podcast, which is a must. Listen. So be sure to check it out in the show notes, Angela, thank you so much for being here. Can you share a little bit more with our listeners about you and what you do? Yeah,

Speaker 3: Absolutely. Thanks so much for having me. It's always fun connecting with amazing humans. So thanks for that. Um, yes. I currently live in Australia, uh, as we were talking about before we hit the recording and, um, but it's, you know, I'm a super proud Canadian and I always say, what's not to love when we have hockey, Tim Horton's and Pamela Anderson or, you know, life is always good. So yes, I mean miss home, but uh, yes, a super proud Canadian. I love the color pink. I tell a straight from the jar. So life is really cool. I've got two delightful little kids Finley John and Chloe Glynn Ella. Uh, they're fantastic humans also, uh, you know, in regards to business-wise it really started though, I'd say 15 years ago, or even before that, I'd say 20 something years ago as a mental health clinician. So I used to diagnose people with schizophrenia, bipolar, depression, autism, et cetera.

Speaker 3: That was my primary focus as a accredited social worker. Uh, and then I had Finley and I just started looking at the toys that he had on the floor one day and I was going, oh, there's to be something better. Now I'm all about electronics. And the S my kids used electronics when I was like at nine months old, and he's putting toys into things and bells and whistles are going. I was like, where is this stimulating? You know, his fine motor skills, his gross motor skills, his, you know, color recognition, et cetera. So went on a hunt and I started looking for products and that's where I started my first business, which was spindly in me. So it was an e-comm platform where we focused on creating childhood memories through play love and travel. Uh, we started out with zero fans, zero followers, you know, the whole zero products.

Speaker 3: We ended up having over 1400 products when we closed. Uh, we had over 70,000 people follow us on Facebook, 20,000 on Instagram, 50,000 plus on our newsletter. And it was the very, the, you know, the beginning of my business journey that e-com, but then a BNB, a bit naive to business from a service side point of view is people started asking to pick my brain. And I didn't really understand what that was at that time. So over a course of two months, I, um, did 14 coffee dates. I don't drink coffee. And finally, in that 14th coffee day, I was driving home and I was like, oh, you know, this isn't sustainable. I can't keep driving an hour return and then spend an hour. And I was like, blah, blah. And I was like, oh, how would I charge these people? I could have a secondary business.

Speaker 3: So clearly it was never on the drawing board, uh, the consulting side of things. And that's how Angela Henderson consulting started. And like you said, now I work with women all around the world, uh, to make sure can get all those pieces in place. Cause there's so many moving pieces to help them reach their first four and five figure months, and then onto six and seven figure years. But I'm very adamant about not burning out as an ex mental health clinician, seeing suicide rates the way they are. And here in Australia, eight people take their life every single day. That's eight, too many. Those numbers have only been increasing obviously with the last year of the pandemic. Uh, and so for me, especially for women, it's important that women understand that you can ask for help. It's important that you can take a rest. It's important that, um, you can make a ton of money and not have to do it hard. Right. So, yeah, that's a little bit about the background.

Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. I love all of that. I'm just like, tell me more, tell me more. So, so the burnout piece for me, I mean, as, as an entrepreneur who, um, you know, started my business back in 2014 as a side hustle, you know, kind of, I think did things the hard way, making a ton of money with, you know, burnout and stress and all of the things, um, taking that hard path that I'm very passionate about, like being transparent about it and also saying like, please don't do what I did. So can you share with, uh, our audience, like how, how do you work with people to create that kind of abundance without the burnout?

Speaker 3: I always say, uh, inside saw I do one-on-one work. I also have a mastermind and I've got a 12 month accelerator program. And for me, uh, though every single month I have a live goal setting session. And one of the questions I say, we go through or be reflecting in this kind of process I have. And then I say, all right, before we even consider anything about what our goals are for the next four weeks, I said, I need you to understand what is your bandwidth? And I make them assess, you know, so for example, if it's Christmas, I'm like, listen guys, everyone, we're conditioned to think that Christmas is married, bright and joyful. But the reality of it is this Christmas can be one of the most stressful times of things having to see your in-laws maybe, um, you might not have the money you want for your kids or whatever it is.

Speaker 3: Right. And so I would, I say to people is, uh, here in Australia, we have six weeks of school holidays. So like, if you've got the in-laws coming and you've got your kids being homeschooled, and you've got this, your bandwidth probably to launch in the middle of all that, isn't probably the best plan. Of course anyone can do anything they want, but I'm about trying to make women have some insight and grace with themselves about what they can and cannot actually, you know, achieve any one of us can achieve anything genuinely. I generally believe that, but it's at what detriment, right? So for me and women are like, oh, you know, a lot of people, I've never heard that. What is my bandwidth to consider before I start just jumping straight to the goal? So that's one of the things that I work with them on another thing is I like to educate the women that I work with is you typically see stress.

Speaker 3: So I could have been stressed. You know, it's 5:00 AM in the morning. Oh my God, am I going to make the thing, you know, stress? But that little stress will go away is when the stress then leads to burnout. When things start to feel heavy and things normally have to start feeling heavy in all areas of adult life, which is home community and work because in order to get a full-blown mental health diagnosis, which is the next step is it has to be impacting all areas of life. It can't just be one, because if it's only one area, then you would go to the root of that problem typically. Right. And say, you know, if it's kids, for example, if they have behavioral problems in school, but they don't when they're on the soccer field and they don't, when they're at home, then we've got to figure out what's going on in the school environment.

Speaker 3: But when it starts to show up in all three areas of our lives. So again, adults, it's home community and work, um, that's when you risk the greater chance of a full-blown mental health diagnosis. So I say to people pay attention to that. Is this heaviness following you everywhere that you go? Or is it just that it's again, that burnout, you're just like, I need a break. Right? Um, and then again, I think, um, what puts me in a position as a, as a great business consultant is that I do have these years of experience because I, I will never be their clinician, but I can also give them the gentle nudge of, Hey, do you need to get a little bit more sleep? Hey, do you maybe need to speak with your GP? Because you've told me you haven't been sleeping for X amount of weeks, and this is going to start to catch up on you.

Speaker 3: What do you think you need to do? So, uh, it's taken me quite subtle, but it can be quite important because, you know, without sleep sleeping problems can, is one of the compound factors, right. Because you can't function without sleep. So yeah. So those are the little things that I would say, what is your bandwidth and how are you feeling on all areas of your life? Because like I said, it will start with stress and will then go to burnout. And then it's a, full-blown mental health likeness. And we know your brain, if you have a full-blown mental health diagnosis, you know, and it really is, you know, acutely a chronic, for example, the reality of it is, is that your brain will never fully be the way it was when it arrived in its original state. Right. Because it's had a break. And so the pathways are different. Things are slightly different and some of us can recover very well, but others might not recover. So I know that it can be quite drastic because when, because when people think of, oh, you know, depression, can't, you just get out of bed type scenario. Right. But the reality of it is, is it can mess with your brain and your capacity to recall memory, et cetera. So it's important to take care of it.

Speaker 2: Uh, it's just, I mean, it's fascinating to listen to you talk about that because as an entrepreneur, without kids, right. I don't have that guard rail to kind of like pull me away from the business. Right. So when you're like, oh, it's just me and my husband, I had a tendency to just go all in all the time. And then I don't know if anybody listening to this can relate. It's like, oh, when I'm stressed about anything in life, I'll just work more. Right. I'll just work to, uh, escape, whatever that's, whatever's going on out there, because I feel like I'm in control here. And so that just like you said, it just compounds and compounds and compounds. And then you're like, but what did I start this business for in the first place I did it because I wanted freedom. I wanted flexibility. I wanted financial independence. And now I've just created a trap for myself that I don't know how to get out of. So part of like pep talks for side hustlers is really like, I want you to create a business and a life in a really healthy way and not a, uh, it's. It's like, it's not worth that the end result is not worth it. If, if that's the path that you're at, that you're taking.

Speaker 3: I think there's two things there too. Is that one, is that going back to your why? This is another thing I do with my women, right? Is if they start to kind of flounder and get into really that hardcore side hustle, 24 7 grind, I always say about why, why are you doing what you're doing? And they're like to make more money. And I'm like, not take that peel a layer off because in my discovery calls with clients, I'll ask them things. And I will say, you know, I want a hundred K I want 200 K, I want to hit the million dah, dah, dah, dah. Then I'm like, my question though, is, is that's all great. But what would that allow you to have in your life that you don't currently have? And that's when they kind of get the knife in the heart, right?

Speaker 3: Oh, I'd have more freedom to spend time with my children. I would do that. So when my women come in, typically the majority of them I've had discovery calls or have heard me talk about this. And I'm like, nah, what would that allow you to have? And I'm like, and I'm like, are you currently experiencing that? And they go, no. And I was like, well, something's going to have to give here. Right. Because you're not doing, if you're, if you're just in business for money, you're not going to be here for long because you're just, you're just counting dollar signs at this stage. I tell you, you won't be here because your heart's not in it. It's not in alignment. So, you know, that's where I will say to women like, Hey, what's going on? I will say also two things on there is one is, um, obviously I've got kids, but in this instance, what you're talking about the trap, right?

Speaker 3: I think there's an opposite side of that too though. And let me explain. A lot of people will say to me, I do, I don't know about 70 podcasts interviews a year and people will say, what are your hobbies? And I'll say, you know, listen, I like to read a book. Obviously I love to travel whenever the hell, that will happen again, like we're trapped in Australia, but anyways, um, whenever that will happen, but I love to travel. I love to experience things. I love good food. I love diet Coke. Uh, I like reading a book and then they'll say, but what is your hobbies? And I was like, yeah, you know, I just putz along in my business and people are like, but you should have hobbies. And I was like, who the hell are you to tell me what I should and shouldn't have.

Speaker 3: Right. I don't want to go and run a marathon. I don't want to go and make soap and candles at the next workshop. Um, I don't want to actually binge watch Netflix for six hours single night and eat bomb bombs and get fat. Like, I don't want that. Right. So I just say on the other essence of that, as long as you still are able to, um, not have balance, and I'm going to talk to you about this, but if you're still able to be present with people when you are with them and you're be able to be present when you're on a phone call and you can be present with that, to me, that's what I strive for. And as a result, my thing is, is if you do want to work on your business, because it brings me joy to write another article, it brings me joy to have conversations with people about an podcast.

Speaker 3: Um, I know like, again, I don't want to binge watch on Netflix. It's okay if you do right. But what I'm saying is for me, I am okay just to keep puttering along. Right. And I've had to really give myself grace with that because everyone's saying hobby, hobby, hobby, you're, you know, are you potentially addicted? Maybe, maybe. Yes. But the thing is, is I'm still present with my kids. So it's, it's something to that. I always just like to have when that conversation comes up, because, uh, you might just find joy in what you do and that's okay.

Speaker 2: Yeah. I love that. That you said that because I, I did in the beginning and then somewhere along the way I lost it. And I really recreated that in the past year, looking at like, okay, like you said, like when a kid is not doing well at school, what's going on there. It's like, okay. I could look at this area of my life. I'm I'm okay here. I'm looking over here. It is the business and it's how I'm being here. And so how, what do I need to shift around to really feel like that passion again and that purpose again. And like, I've proven that I can make money. That's great. I love that. It brings me security. It brings me all of that, but that, but at the end of the day, it's like, that's not what it was all about for me in the, in the beginning it was, and then it shifted and now it's coming back to like, okay, now I have the money piece covered. I feel financially safe and secure, you know, what's the next thing it's like, oh, it's to figure out how to do this and be happy and generous and thrive. And, you know, do I need a hobby? I don't know, but I love now. I love doing this again. And I'm also not spending every waking moment disconnected from the people that I, that are important to me, but still really being able to thrive in it. So that's really the goal, right.

Speaker 3: Is I think when we start off in business, because we do have to like wonder where the next dollar is coming from, right? I'm not about hustling, but there is an essence of hard work. If one person's working in their business for an hour a day and someone gets to work four hours a day. Most times, even if that person is working for four hours is unproductive for two, they're still going to outweigh the person who's only working an hour. So the reality of it is anyone who says that you don't work hard. I call. I don't, you do have to work hard at the beginning. Right. But again, being mindful that it's not forever and having practices in place to go for a walk or the gym or whatever. But I also think that when we start to get to multi-six figures and on seven figures is for me personally, is I now have space to think of impact and how I can make impact.

Speaker 3: So my role isn't necessarily like I might be in the business for example, putzing along, but I'm also looking at like, you know, I'm working with my lawyers now to get my foundation up. For example, like my time is just shifted because I've got more time back because I've got a little bit more of a team to help me. Right. And because of that, I can go, okay, now I've got this money and I don't need to go to the grave with all this money. What can I do to contribute back? And there's an element for me where things shifted and that's this kind of, you know, foundation how I can help other people is almost like my other project now. Right. And that project brings me joy. It's no different if I went to volunteer, right. It's, it's just that it's attached to this business.

Speaker 3: Cause I'll be able to take money from this business and put it in the other business as a donation, as a tax write off too. Like it's a, it's a win-win. So I think there's something beautiful about when you start to grow more, you shift. Yes. But you also, if you choose to, you can start to look at the bigger impact, the bigger legacy that you can genuinely leave. And my other thing is I go back to that word balance is I actually think balance is. And I think that if you look at the genuine definition about kind of like equal distribution is I also had to learn earlier on is because I used to still work full time. Well, I got both of these businesses going, so my time was very tight, but the reality of it is, is I could never be, you know, a 10th of the 10th with my partner, 10th of me attend with the kids, whatever.

Speaker 3: And then the guilt started to come in. I used to also fly internationally a lot for, you know, speaking events and things like that. And so I wouldn't be with my kids. And so my thing was, is I had to learn that it was okay that I could be an amazing mom, but it was also okay for it to put me first because my kids are leaving. And it was also okay for my kids to understand that when I'm on a call right now, I'm present with you doing this call. And when I'm done, I will be present making their lunches and getting them ready. And when I'm present at my retreats or working with clients it's okay. So I I've had to wipe the word of balance in my life and replace it with the word of being present, because you can always be present if you choose to.

Speaker 2: I love that. And you know, I think one of the things that, um, that I, I S I had a challenge with is just, I was always just disconnected from everything that I was doing. You know, it's like, oh, I'm with you, but I'm thinking about that. Or I'm with my husband, but I'm checking emails on my phone and really kind of that contributed a lot, I think, to just always feeling like, oh, you're never enough, right. Cause you're, you're here, but you're not present. You're doing this, all of these other things. And I, I totally agree with you. I think balances BS also. And it's really just about like giving a hundred percent to what you're doing for the time that you're doing it. And then shifting in into that other thing. So you mentioned that you worked full time while you built these two businesses.

Speaker 2: I wanted to ask you, I wanted to let go back to like building the e-commerce business. Cause I know we have a lot of people here who are new they're in that like new stage, they're like kind of the solar preneur stage. They haven't shifted to, to CEO yet. And you're like, you mentioned like, oh, I built this business from 0, 0, 0, 0. Like, how did you like take just kind of going back to those early days? Like, how did you shift from zero to growing it to the, you know, the, the success that you had with it? Like, what were some of those first few steps that you had to take to kind of get that momentum?

Speaker 3: Yeah. I mean, for me is I always go back as I didn't obviously know it then, but what I teach and model with all the people that I work with was it ultimately came down to the foundations, right. Is like, first of all, you needed a good product. You know? And the analogy that I use is I can't, if, when women come to me and I'm like, listen, I will say a bit more diplomatically, but the reality of it is, is I can't, I can't change a turd. If your product smells like, looks like. And probably tastes like. It's probably. Right? It doesn't matter if I then try to wrap, um, cotton around it and pink, glitter and feathers as AK tried different marketing strategies, it's still going to be. So nothing's going to work. So I go back to the foundations and the foundations and the reason why I am where I am now and that my clients, I believe are where they are, because they've taken their action.

Speaker 3: Again. I will say my client success comes down to their inaction or action and it's their success, not my success. I just guided them along the way. But for me personally, it's the foundations understanding your product, understanding that you need to have great messaging when people land on your website, making sure that you've got a great conversional website. I don't give two rips. If it's pretty, I don't give two rips or whatever. If you don't have messaging above the fold, the call to action above the fold, away for them to get into your funnel, et cetera. Like your website is just in many ways, you might as well not have it. Right. So having a conversional website, uh, like I said, then being able to start and have conversations with people. So what is your funnel? What, how are you bringing them into your ecosystem?

Speaker 3: Uh, you know, then again, what is your, uh, organic strategy for visibility? What is your partnership strategy for visibility? What is your page strategy for, for visibility? Because without visibility, you don't have a business, you don't have people to sell for, uh, to, uh, looking at eventually then team, right? So it's like that next foundation, like you said, is a lot of us start with no support. We're doing everything. But being able to understand that once those foundations are in place, there's certain things that also you can't continue to do. You just can't because it's out of your zone of genius and the time that it's taking. So those are the things that I really, the analogy I use is that of the story of the three little pigs is most businesses come to me and they've got a business made out of hay or business made out of sticks.

Speaker 3: It's structurally there, but it wouldn't take much as a marital breakdown, loss of income, a child gets sick or you get sick. COVID comes into your world that this is now crushed. So when I work with people, I'm like, these foundations need to be made of bricks because, and the thing is, is bricks might be heavier and they cost a little bit more. But if you can lay the bricks, you know, Dan, so again, if you've got a great product, great messaging, but your website sucks, our bricks have already started to crack. So I'm like pay someone didn't mean someone early on in the piece to get you a proper website, doesn't have to have all the bells and whistles, but something, because some of the most conversional websites I've seen are the ugliest websites. I've seen the fact that they can, they do what they need to do when people get there.

Speaker 3: Right? So work with someone such as yourself or your team or whatever, like to get that website converting. Um, because if, again, that brick is cracked, everything else above it is going to be cracked. So that's, that's why I went from zero to, you know, when we wrapped up from, they may, because the reality of it was is once I caught, caught on going, there's a crack over here, our leaky bucket, people aside, I'm like, ha, oh, hold on. No it's. Cause I tried to shortcut something circuit, cut something, uh, take a few dollars off. And it's not all, not all the best things of these bricks have to be the most expensive brick. I'm not asking you to go get gold-plated bricks. What I'm saying is this. They just need to be solid. You can always build on things. Do you mean on your own house after?

Speaker 3: Right. But the essence is, is that they're solid enough because if, again, if you try and then get to growth and scale stage, cause I look at businesses, startup growth and scale, you try to get to the growth and scale stage. What happens is you go one, you get two steps forward and then you keep going back because things will start to crack. And you don't understand. So with Finley and me and with Angela Henderson consulting, it's always been about that. You know, I, I also get a lot of. Sometimes are more passive, aggressive comments is I've helped people get from, you know, 300 K in a year to 2.2 million. I've taken e-comm businesses also. And that was a service based business. E-comm business from 1.1 million to 2.8 million, like the list goes on, but then people will say in this business, I haven't hit the seven figures.

Speaker 3: I've hit seven figures, cumulatively, and I'm a multi six figure business owner yearly, but I haven't hit it in one like one year and people will say, oh, but you know, you don't know what you don't know or you don't know like, why should you be coaching these people if you haven't hit it for this business? But my scenario here in that instance is I've got proven track record across people. And the other instances is alignment. And I've also been learning a lot about human design lately. And one of the things we know is I don't, I don't want a five, I don't want 5,000 people in my community. It's not that I can't help them, but I prefer smaller, intimate, um, cohort. So like right now I'm working with a hundred clients on any given week through my programs. But some people I know are working with literally 5,000 people a week.

Speaker 3: Right. But what I've also learned because of the human design and how it's, you know, part of my design makeup is that actually, that's why I probably believe where I am, where I am, where this business, because I'm very much about human to human marketing, the experience and interaction one faces with a brand. And I'm also for me personally, and it's nothing against Amy Porterfield who has 5,000 people in her launches. She's an amazing kind human. But for my, again, my design makeup, what I'm learning is is that I actually, for me, I can't, I need to know people's names and who they are and that they're not just a transaction for me. Um, and that's part of what lights me up and keeps me going. So again, I've also had to learn that these foundations I'm talking about, does it necessarily mean that you're going to hit the six and seven figures, right.

Speaker 3: A wipe. It has shown me that you have to be in alignment and it's coming. Right. But the thing is, is you have to stay in alignment, oral to gain those foundations alignment as part of those foundations, if you're not aligned with what you're doing and how you're growing and scaling things will start to crack again eventually. So that's how I've looked at Findlay and me, for example, that's how I look at understanding a little bit more of who I am and what I do. And that again, just because I haven't gotten there in this particular collectively, yes, I've been a millionaire with all the things combined. But the reality of it is, is that doesn't mean you can't get there, right? It just might be a matter of time. So it's important to do that. Obviously perception is very big in the world of internet, et cetera, you know, perception.

Speaker 3: Oh, but she hasn't gotten there yet, but you don't. But my business is solid. And in my last thing I'll say with that is, is an example is with the pandemic is not pandemic iOS changes on Facebook, right? I'm getting quite a few people who I've known in masterminds and stuff who have solely been reliant on Facebook ads and Elmo, almost a launch model thing. And they'd be spending a hundred K a month on Facebook ads and they've been quite profitable, but guess who's reaching out to me now and I need a new ads manager and I need this now because iOS isn't working for me. They didn't, they were too dependent and reliant on a social media platform that haven't got a conversional website. They don't have SEO on their websites. They're not having other funnels coming in. That those businesses though, they have made way more than me.

Speaker 3: We're talking like five millions, way more. They actually are on the brink of losing it all because their foundations have not been in place. So though I haven't hit a million dollars in one year, yet close, but not yet. The reality of it is, is, um, I've built a business from sustainability and while I'm seeing people crack right now, I'm still here making more money than ever. I'm not dependent on launch models. Facebook ads have never worked for me. I've grown what I have organically. So for me, it's just remember perception is a big thing and just keep chugging along, but continue to build those foundations because you want to be here in seven years, you want a sustainable and profitable business, not things that are going to peak and peak and have valleys. So just again, another little thing to be thinking about.

Speaker 2: I am so, so glad that you said all of that. I can resonate with everything that you said. I am not about launched models either. I'm about consistent revenue, you know, consistent, stable, like, and, you know, setting yourself up for growth and scaling. I feel like the launch model is like, I don't know. I also didn't Facebook ads have never worked for me. I've dabbled here and there. I know it's probably because I've never really gone all in on them. Um, I've not like I have not invested in them, like the way that I could have if I wanted to grow, but I've grown through, I've grown, we're on track for half a million this year and it's all organic, all organic. So it's all relationship building. It's all, any all of the marketing strategies that I use could be picked. If the internet went away, I could continue to grow this business.

Speaker 2: Like, you know, and so I feel like, and we're super profitable also. And I'm like, sometimes I wonder, I'm like, oh, if I really went all in on Facebook ads, what could we do? I could have a bigger impact because it's not about necessarily me making more money. Um, unless I have a really solid plan for that money. Like you said, like a foundation or hiring more people and paying my team really well or, or all of that stuff. And, you know, I think I have had the same experience where people come to me and they're like, oh, Hey, uh, my business is falling apart. Tell me how you do what you do because my, my Facebook ads have tanked and I'm screwed. And I'm just like, I just meet people and talk to them and build relationships and collaborate and do partnerships and, you know, make friends and it's super fun. Um, and it's more strategic than that, but that's kind of, that's kind of how I've done it. And I feel like, um, I can relate to you on, you know, faceless transaction versus wanting it to wanting to really like, know who I'm helping and kind of dig in there and like, um, get, get into the, not into the weeds, but really kind of like watching them kind of transform and move along. So I just wanted to, I was just like, yes, I'm so glad you said all of that. I mean, th th there's

Speaker 3: Here's the reality is there's only three ways to gain visibility. Because again, without visibility, you don't have a business there's organic partnerships and paid that's it and people over-complicate it, but no that's genuinely, you're either organically building it. You then in through organic, again, like you said, you're building those relationships, which then turn into partnerships. Not necessarily they're a partner in your business, but give away sharing each other stuff in newsletters, et cetera. And then paid what I see most people is that they can do the organic and partnerships really well and get to probably just, I mean, I would say that's what I do. Well kind of under that seven figure mark. Right? But it's, if you want to scale, because you need more people to know about you as a visibility factor, not as an ego factor, but just pure visibility and numbers.

Speaker 3: That's where, whether or not it's YouTube ads, Pinterest ads, Facebook ads, because it can go to multiple people to the mean over multiple didn't mean time distributions. See it. So again, when I say to businesses, well, what are you doing is, you know, there's that the visibility, key, organic partnership and paid when you have all three firing, you typically start to hear people say things like, um, and you're everywhere. I'd get on the internet. I just saw you over here. I then went to Instagram. You were there. I heard you on a podcast at that. Like it starts working where that's kind of like, um, Scott Alford talks about it being the Omni presence. But in regards to the business, if we go back to the, the basics is that you need to build your audience. You need to nurture your audience and you need to sell to your audience.

Speaker 3: And most people can do those first ones, okay. Building your audience, they then can typically do it poorly because they're chasing the transaction. So everything's always didn't mean about putting something in front of them, which is okay. Or I have women who do great at nurturing and great at building the audience, but they feel they can't ask for the sale. Because if I ask for the sale, what will my community think about me? Well, that's fine. I guess you're running a charity now and not a business because the reality of it is, is no one's ever, you're not going to ever make money because you never telling anyone about the amazing thing you have. And that's where I say is if you struggle with selling, selling is a reframe to serving. All you're doing is every day going out there and serving to your audience and amazing thing on a platter that is going to help transform their world.

Speaker 3: So if you really do struggle with selling, reframe it with, I get to wake up today and go serve. And I'm going to just tell them that this is what I do, and this is how I can help them. And I think people also have realize is if you are working from a place of organic visibility and partnership visibility, the reality of it is if you feel bad about or sleazy about selling is you're lucky a 5% of people see what you have in your feed. So if you have a a hundred people on your Instagram audience, only five of those people will see what you have. And even less of that will consume what is on whatever they see that you're posting for the day. So you're, I've never an almost 11 years of being in business. Has anyone ever emailed me and said, Andy, you're selling too much stock?

Speaker 3: No, never. Um, and it's, you got to constantly keep doing, I mean, just remembering the essence of, you know, uh, I have this framework where I talk about, you need to show up, you need to have a strategy to where you're showing up and you need to be able to ask for the sale. Uh, and when I say showing up, it's, it's really about Shannon understanding. So many people try to be on every platform. Where are you showing up? That brings you joy. So does Instagram bring you joy or is it like, God, I hate being here fricking don't be there. Then generally ask yourself, where are the platforms you're showing them that bring you joy? And the second thing is, are the platforms you're on actually where your client consumes content. So for me is, and you, don't also, in my opinion, want to be doing all of these platforms at once.

Speaker 3: I started with Facebook and Instagram, then I added a Facebook group. So when I say Facebook, it was just posting on the page. So then I added a group. Then from there, I was able to do that really well. Um, and then from that, we then added the podcast and then last year we added Pinterest, right? Like it didn't all happen at once. I understood where my people were. I then started showing up on that and I did each of those steps really well. So again, just, you know, be mindful about build your audience, nurture your audience, ask for the style, understanding that your visibility only comes from organic partnership in paid. And that again, showing up, having a strategy behind that, and again, selling is going to be imperative for your business to keep working for you and not against you.

Speaker 2: Wow. That is so powerful. And I wanted to ask you, like, what are the biggest shifts you see happen for people who are going from solar preneur to, you know, to growing a team, really stepping into that CEO role in their business, because that's really been my transformation so far in the past year is shifting out of like lone Wolf, solar preneur. Do we eat it all into like CEO, building a team, you know, kind of shifting what I'm spending my time on and, and, and my role in the business. But what are some of the, you know, some of the biggest shifts and transformations that you see people go through that you've worked with, who are going from like multiple six figures onto like seven?

Speaker 3: I mean, I always say the number one thing is the shifts will happen quicker if your mindset is better. So, I mean, and all of us, I mean, reflection is always, you know, hindsight's always a powerful thing, right? Yeah. But, you know, I know for myself and for my clients, those of them who are willing to work on the internal. So, and because I believe your external world is a reflection of your internal world. So if you're running a business that feels chaotic because you're doing everything yourself and whatever, there's something internal that needs to switch. And the switch does it necessarily mean that you also have the aha going, where's the root of this because we're having whatever's going on internally is normally a root. So what I say, most women, when they're still hanging on and almost being like wearing it like a badge of honor, is that they haven't, um, hit the pain bad enough yet to do a difference, or they have finally then had the pain, hit them and they do a difference, but it doesn't necessarily mean they've worked internally.

Speaker 3: It just means that the pain has gotten so bad that they're like, oh my God, I finally, I cracked out to do something. But when I see those women have the internal aha moment and they get to the root of whatever. So their limiting beliefs or self-sabotaging, you know, behaviors, et cetera. Those are my women that I just see skyrockets. There's like, no, holding them back. And so for me is, it's not just about the strategy that you have in your business and these foundations. It's also about what work are you doing in the internal now I will also say, I think the reason why most businesses don't focus on the internal at the beginning, I too didn't was because you literally are in startup stage, wondering how do I get this going? You don't literally, we all have enough time if you choose to wear your prioritize thing.

Speaker 3: But generally when you're in that startup and if you're a mother, and if you like for me, like I was, and then I'm also working full time. There's only so much that you can do to be present, right? And so you kind of have to pick your battles, but as you start to make more money, and that's why I believe is that, what do you get to those kind of 200 K 300, 500 and onward is you actually get your time back to actually go and do the bigger work. And when you get your cause you also have to pay for that stuff. So you have to pay for that and have the time to do that. And when you're in startup, you don't have that. So that's why I do. I see people kind of almost have to go through this hardness, even though people may be hearing about it, work on your mindset, work on your mindset.

Speaker 3: They don't have this space yet to do it, but to get to those next breakthrough levels. Because the thing is, is every breakthrough level comes another mindset. You know what I mean, thing that you've overcome. So for me also is in the last three years, I've had my grandmother died on Christmas. My brother died on mother's day. A father died, father type figure die on new year's day. I've also had a friend die a few weeks after the new year's day death. And then I've also just recently lost a best friend from high school. So for me is, is understanding the, um, people say, but N she still showed up at your podcast every week. You still have done this. You still have done, this is, it's not that I have aggrieved because of grief could hit me various stages as I'm driving or whatever.

Speaker 3: I still agree. But the thing was is my mindset is quite solid as the, and so I'm very grateful that I put the work into the mindset, because if I didn't, I don't know if I'd still be here because after not just a, your neighbors passed away, like these are significant, significant people in my world, and then to die all on significant dates. So it's like every Christmas, it's a reminder. Every mother's day, it's a reminder, every new year's day, it's a reminder. Right. But my mindset was solid at that stage. Right. And I think it's always been solid, but I'd been working even more on it that I have been able to get through it. I have been able to also look at the fact that your life is your effing responsibility. You know, so I have a responsibility of what I do every single day.

Speaker 3: When I wake up, do I do this or do I do this? But whatever you do do not to other people are going to Facebook and moan about it because you've made those active decisions. Right. So I know it's kind of like a convoluted answer to your question, but the, these are the things that didn't mean. I have seen the transformation occur most is that they normally hit enough pain that they need the team. Um, and then probably once that team is there and they start to get time back, they're able to start looking at the mindset and have the space. And that's when I see the transformation. So it's not actually hiring the team that I see the transformation. It's, it's the beginning of the transformation of allowing to, because they're buying time back is what I see.

Speaker 2: I think you just read my story, uh, there now, um, for me in the beginning, I just didn't know mindset was a thing. Like literally there was not even, it was like, oh, figure out tactics and strategies. It wasn't even like on my radar that I might have things in my way that would prevent me from being successful. And yeah, it wasn't until, um, it wasn't until hitting those painful points where it's like, oh, well, I cannot continue. It's like, it's a fork in the road. You either get help or you shot half the business down. And it wasn't like a third. I wasn't going to ever quit, but it was like, you can not keep going the way that you're going. And then it was like, oh, I need to figure out how to lead this team, because I've only led myself, which then, and I've had some mindset work along the way, but then it was like, oh, deep going diving into the deep end of the mindset that, you know, it's all about how you're being, how you show up, how you think, how this is going to set the stage for the success of the team and all the things.

Speaker 2: So I'm really in the thick of thick of that work right now. And for anybody listening, like, don't wait to get that support. You're, you're, you'll go farther faster if you don't wait until it all breaks down.

Speaker 3: And I also would say, it's not just, I've also been, uh, when I first started my, I would say my Wu factor was zero. What the hell are you all talking about? You know what I mean? I don't know kumbaya.

Speaker 2: It's just, cause I think it, you know,

Speaker 3: Like what the hell, but as I've gotten smarter at obviously an older, um, the reality of it is, is I believe a successful business is looking at your strategy. It's looking at your mindset, but it's also looking at the spirituality side of things. I do believe it's a tri-factor in there. Um, and for me personally, like looking at human design, for example, and going, what does the human design, what does my makeup actually allow me to do? And where are my strengths? And you know, I've just met with one human design person. I've got another consult with them. And I was like, oh yeah, that explains it. Well, if I would've known about my human design 10 years ago in business, I would have been in such a different place. Right. Um, if I would have no one, uh, the essence of hypnotherapy, I I've just been working with my own coach for the last six months.

Speaker 3: And part of it, I mean, you know, I'm very open. It was $45,000 to work with this particular person. And, um, one of the things he said was Angie also get 12 free hypnotherapy sessions. And I'm like, let's, let's rephrase it. This is free. I've paid for these sessions. Right? Like, let's make that clear. Uh, he kind of looked at me, but I was like, no, no, no, let's make it clear. You ain't giving me anything for free bank. I paid for these. Um, and so I was like, man, I've already paid 45 grand. This is like a house deposit. My is like, I'm in, I will do whenever you tell me, cause I'm going to everything and hypnotherapy, it has probably changed my life. It's because the therapy's got this bad stigma around, like you're supposed to, like, you go into whatever and you cluck like chickens.

Speaker 3: No, it's, it's, it's nothing like that whatsoever. And so for me, the hypnotherapy, some of the stuff that's come from that and where the root of the thing is. So I'll give you an example is I had a client come to me. Uh, she's a one-to-one client. So, you know, VIP high touch point whenever. And she made a comment about, well, I thought there was going to be more templates when I worked with you, one-to-one in my brain. I'm like, what does she mean more templates? Like this is a highly customized, personalized in the mean, uh, sessions. And then I went back and I was like, actually, no, as for what she needed, she got this template to get it. Anyway, she'd already been given like 10, 10 plates. So first of all, it was like, she'd been given 10 templates based on your individual.

Speaker 3: You know what I mean, strategy plan. And, but then my, but my brain went to ball. If she thinks I don't have enough templates to my other clients and there's another templates, oh my goodness, am I not giving them what they need? And so then it was this really weird thing. And so, and hypnotherapy that week that my lady said, what, is there anything you want to ask or talk about? And so I gave the scenario, she goes, well, let's just see where it goes, funnily enough. She, and, um, I'll show you, cause there's a sticky note that still sits on my desk from the session she said to me, um, takes you, she counts you down and then she counts you down again. And uh, she said, all right. So in regards to this situation, where do you think this may have come from?

Speaker 3: Whatever. And then all of a sudden, boom, I was in my mom's kitchen, not obviously physically, but it's where it was. And I remember walking past her computer and it was, she had separated from my dad. So she was studied like online dating. And I just remember seeing my name on the screen. And I was like, that's what I was literally walking by. So it was about, that was weird. And I saw said this to this other person that she was obviously in conversation with. She had told him, oh yeah, my daughter's in medical school. My daughter's got a GPA of this. My daughter has this, but it was all not true. I wasn't in medical school, I was doing an undergrad in social work, psychology in that stage. All right. And I was like, in my burner, like, well, why would she do that?

Speaker 3: But I was like, whatever doing kept going. But the, my clients saying isn't there enough templates, the root of it that brought up in hypnotherapy was that I was not good enough. Even though I had never used the words in my entire life. I'm not good enough because my confident I'm a pretty confident person, but somewhere it was rooted in me that I was not good enough. And because until we got to the root of that, it probably still would have continued to show up in little things or trigger me in little things. Right. And so that's an example was where hypnotherapy was able to get to the root. And it was me saying that I ultimately, I was thinking from an unconscious subconscious level that I wasn't good enough, but the reality was is that, so then she took me kind of one step further.

Speaker 3: And then, you know, at that stage, and I'm not a huge crier, but I'm always like, oh, am I not a good enough mom? Right. And so it was this thing. So now that like you're able to get to the root of it and you're like, actually, no, I am fine. And I am good enough. And then she, she does this exercise. Like, what would you want to say to your mom and blah, blah, blah, super powerful. But I would never have, if she would have said to me without being in a hypnosis type of estate, Hey, where do you think this stem from? I would never have gone. It happened on this day as I walked past the computer. So that's an example of when you start to truly look at other modalities than just say strategy and mindset, you have opportunity to also then do the mean, go deeper within what's going on for yourself.

Speaker 3: And because, and then, so the SOC said like, write this sticky notes. I wrote this thing where it's like, I am enough, I'm doing enough. I'm giving enough, just keep going. Right. So this is again, perception, people will say, and you've got all your together. Everything's in your favor. You've got all these things. But again, when you like the perceptions that, but if you allow yourself to work on things internally, you will always be working on this. So I've done hypnotherapy for three months. You don't have to do it forever. I I'm in the middle of a few launches and things. And when I did hit enough therapy, I prefer to do it every on the same day, every week for those 12 weeks, I just felt like the continuity is what was best for me. Um, I'll go back to it 100% because there's more to do.

Speaker 3: And that's the thing is mindset in the internal work is not sexy. It's not fun. Like if anyone would have said, you're going to wake up today and go back to this memory, I would have been like, well, why would I like it's I'm over and done with, but clearly somewhere in my subconscious that was not done with, right. So again, the work is never done. So, you know, this year a lot, I've been working with different healers, body talk specialists, hypnotherapists. Um, I also work with a money, energy person. If someone would've told me that three years ago, I would have laughed in your face. Right. But again, as you grow and have time to genuinely start to receive that knowledge and you can do something with that knowledge, do it because it will change your life. So again, if you can do it earlier, and that's why in my programs, my one-to-one my mastermind and pro foot pillows is that I have myself as a, as a head strategist.

Speaker 3: But I also bring on a mindset coach who does monthly live mindset coaching. And I also actually have a spiritual healer also, too. So what happens is, is I'm letting my clients know that these are the things. And so even though they may not think it I'll be on a call, I'll be doing their strategy. And I'll be like, have you been attending the mindset? And they're like, no. And I'm like, well, they're all prerecorded. I need you to go back to may 20, 21, where they were talking about self sabotage, because I need you to start hearing this or what you're doing is going to keep staying the same. And so I believe it, now that I have this insight, that it is my responsibility to equip my clients with a bunch of different things. So another example is journaling. I don't personally journal, but I know that there's significant benefits from journaling. So I will bring in a journal expert so that those people who do want to receive that information can take that. So I do think we've got responsibilities as consultants and coaches to let women know if the other things that could be working for them, not just the strategy part of it.

Speaker 2: That is so powerful. And just, I mean, just the, the idea that like, oh, you know, where do you think that, like, if you did not put yourself in a position to dig deeper than what you could mentally consciously do, right? Like you, that would have been plaguing you all, all along the way. And you probably saw all the places where, you know, oh, that's where that came up. And that's why that didn't work out. And that's this, and it like kind of shines a light on all of that. This conversation has been absolutely fascinating. I could talk to forever. We're almost out of time, but I have one more question that I ask everybody who comes on the show. And that is what belief about yourself. Did you have to change to get to where you are today?

Speaker 3: I mean, there'll be something, but someone's asked me a similar question before. And I guess my mentality has always just been like, it will always work. Like I've never not thought that it wasn't going to work. Right. So I've always kind of been not being a Dick or anything, but I've always that, but I'm like, but I'm like, it was never a non-negotiable right. As in that it will work and, you know, um, belief maybe, um, uh, I would probably say a belief, I would say around again, this was what was brought up for me, but I guess, cause we're talking about the subconscious is the very first round, the more money you make you'll lose it. So both my parents followed bankruptcy, not once, but twice. And so when I started working with a, um, money healer lady around money, the first thing she said was your belief that you're going to lose everything.

Speaker 3: And I was like, oh, and she's like, uh, she's like, they keep coming up with bankruptcy. And I just, again, the first time I ever did it, I was like, what the going on? And then I like looked at her and I was like, I'm here. Like I'm sold. Like the intake form was, what was your name? What was your web address? And what was your, uh, no, not even webinar. What was your name and what was your email? Those it, so there's no way. She, she was not friends with me on Facebook. I've never talked about my parents bankruptcy anywhere. Uh, right. Or maybe on a podcast. She wouldn't have had time to listen. I was like, take my money. Right. So I didn't necessarily have a belief. It was like sitting kind of like no one to me, but what I found was this belief that again, I'd lose it all is what it came down to.

Speaker 3: Right. And what did it stem from the fear of what might say my parents have everything and getting everything stripped of everything. So again, working on the internal and like I said, because at the beginning again, people ask about with time and I'm like, I've never really led anything. Like I said, even with the deaths of my family members that, that it's like, just keep going. Like it's, it's, it's ingrained in me almost. So I've never really had a lot of like negative self-talk shattering. Uh, for me personally, uh, I know a lot of women experience it. I'm not saying that I never, um, self doubt or go, what am I going to do? But then I'll kind of sit in my pity and then I'm like, let's rock and roll. Right. So I'm not saying it doesn't ever present itself, but I don't let it dwell. And I've never looked at it as it's not gonna do to mean like nothing's going to get in my way. Like, it's kind of like, I'll work it out. I

Speaker 2: Totally relate to that because when I decided that I was going to start my business and quit my job, I was like, it's a done deal. Like nothing is going to stop me, you know? And I'll work through every obstacle that comes. And I might take the long way sometimes, but I'll still keep going. Like I'm never going to quit it and I can relate to you on the whole like, oh, but it could all go away at any second. Like, I'll create it, but it could all disappear. And so I've been really like working on like, no, it's fine. And even if it did, you'd build it again. It's fine. You're fine. Like,

Speaker 3: And I know when COVID came that like my family, again, other people's fears, and I think that's something that's important to note too, is that in my experiences, you actually entrepreneurship, there's actually a lot of grief in entrepreneurship. There's actually a lot of loss because wherever there is lost, there is grief and you will lose friends and you will get, you will shed family members because they no longer fit do the mean in your space because you have grown and you've done the work and they're still stuck. Right. So understand that that will happen. Um, but yes, like, I don't know. I could talk about entrepreneurship. It's a great and beautiful thing. Right? And you don't have to be stuck if you don't want to, you can take responsibility if you want to, uh, you can just rock and roll with it if you want to. Right. The choice is yours, whatever you want, you genuinely can go and get it if you choose to,

Speaker 2: Oh, that is the perfect place to wrap up this episode. Thank you so much for being here. Can you share with everyone where they can go to connect with you and just get into your world?

Speaker 3: Yeah. I always say head to my website, Angela henderson.com did a U. And from there you can read our blog articles, listen to the podcast, the business and life conversations podcast, or you can, um, get, you know, I'm over on Instagram at Angela Henderson consulting. So wherever you consume content or wherever you hang out, go there. But yeah, ultimately, always I head to my website, Angela henderson.com to you, and then choose where you want to see yourself, uh, and what works best for you and your family, your life, et cetera.

Speaker 2: Awesome. We'll, I'll link all that up in the show notes. So you guys can go to Shannon matter and.com forward slash 3, 5, 7, get all the links and thank you again. I really appreciated talking to you. Thanks so

Speaker 3: Much. You have a fantastic day. Thanks for everything. I appreciate it. All